Agoge - Spartan Military Training

Apr 26, 2008 7:55 PM

Guest :

I am pretty sure that Spartan men, citizens, did not actually get to live in their homes and kept living in barracks until the age of sixty, when they retired. The reason I am sure is because they had to sneak out of the barracks to sleep with their wives.

Apr 30, 2008 7:23 AM

Guest :

At the age of 30,, Spartan Soldiers were allowed to own land,, and then was when they were able to marry, and have children, Im sure it was hard for the women,, when they wed,, their heads were shaved and dressed in battle uniforms and lead into the communial barreks to consumate their marriage,,.

May 5, 2008 12:04 PM

Guest :

they had to be 30 before leaving the barracks to live and the children were not thrown off the cliff they were left thier

May 6, 2008 6:27 AM

Guest :

Spartans most importan weapon was thier shield. When they went to war their wives said "come back with your shield or on it".

May 6, 2008 6:31 AM

Guest :

Spartans most importan weapon was thier shield their wives said"come back with your shiled or on it"when the left for war and yes the babies were thrown off the cliff if they cried when they were born

Aug 19, 2008 5:33 PM

Guest :

Spartans most importan weapon was thier shield their mothers gave to them when they completed training, it was the one time they were premitted to visit their mother as an equal and not as a military superior male.
It what their mother who said, with your shield or on it when she first gave it to him on this occasion, they were not to be given another one.

babies have never been proven to be thrown off the cliff at any time, they were left out to be exposed if they had any birth defects visible, if they cried when they were born they were evaluated as strong potensial soldiers the same as any that didnt. those that did not cry were put in for officer training when joining at 7 year old.

Sep 3, 2008 8:57 AM

Guest :

I THINK ALL SPARTANS MARRIED THEIR WIVES OR COUSINS

Sep 5, 2008 5:00 PM

Guest :

the spartens where only aloued to get married after the age of 30

Sep 7, 2008 6:50 PM

Guest :

well really they lived in the barracks until age 60 but when married had the weekends(whenever that was to them) to sleep with their wives at home.

Sep 15, 2008 6:02 AM

Guest :

i was a spartan for 53 years and now that its all over i wish i could still kill some of them persian bastards

Sep 23, 2008 6:09 AM

Guest :

Is war a form of art in Sparta?

Sep 25, 2008 4:33 AM

Guest :

nope the text is right, they had to sneak out to sleep with their wives, until they were thirty, when they could live at home. however they had to eat in the Syssitia (barracks) everynight.
also, they did usually 'expose' the children but i believe they did sometimes throw them off the cliff, thucydides (i think) and some other greek historian recounts this.

Sep 26, 2008 8:03 AM

Guest :

I agree this is all a lie put before our eyes by the la le lu li lo.

Oct 2, 2008 7:30 AM

Guest :

drop the baby down down down to the bottom of the sea me and sponge bob and the under water sun underwater suuun d(-_-)b lol monkey

Oct 2, 2008 7:59 AM

Guest :

i think they were alowed to marry at age 20 but not live with them untill 30

Oct 8, 2008 11:01 AM

Guest :

spartans are beast america needs to take some advice from them lol

Oct 21, 2008 7:37 AM

Guest :

to all the people who think that this is a lie. we spartans were the best and all is true .there was no RESPECT for the weak and woman had to live with it or be doomed

Oct 27, 2008 2:26 PM

Guest :

I AM SPARTA

Oct 28, 2008 7:01 PM

Guest :

Not bad.

Oct 29, 2008 5:14 AM

Guest :

Spartans! Prepare for Glory!!!

Oct 29, 2008 9:30 AM

Guest :

in response to the spartan women and the lack of respect shown, i will say this, sometimes in military life there are points where you don't give a person the cirtiuos respect that would be nomaly due, this is designed to break down the indivdual, to educate them that they will be more successfull operating as a unit, rather than indvidualy. spartan women who probly didn't learn this in the agoge had to be shown that they needed there spouse...and they didn't have the same though process we do today.the women may not have thought it was a bad thing. Greek culture of this time shows service to the City state above all else, Spartan men served by being warriors nad the women served by makeing spartan babies. i donno i'm just saying.

Nov 1, 2008 10:51 PM

Guest :

the Spartans got to marry when they were 20 years old but had to remain in the barracks until 30. They did get to leave the barracks when 30 but they still had to sneak out to see their wives if they chose to marry between 20 and 30.

Nov 5, 2008 10:43 AM

Guest :

This Is SPARTA!!!

Nov 5, 2008 10:49 AM

Guest :

This Is SPARTA!!!

Nov 13, 2008 5:04 PM

Guest :

cool

Nov 19, 2008 8:06 AM

Guest :

It isnt actully proven that they threw the disformed babies or babies with probles off a cliff because one of there greatest leaders walked with a limp since he was born, and if they threw "sick" babies off cliffs then he should have been thrown off

Nov 25, 2008 5:47 AM

Guest :

wow throwing their baby's over a cliff edge seemed pretty harsh. it's a BABY!

Nov 27, 2008 10:32 PM

Guest :

When it comes to combat, and little weakness can and will get you killed. If you notince, by being harsh, they created the toughest people of the world. Just remember, 300 Spartans and about 800 other Greeks held off a Prsian invasion of thousands for three days, until they were attacked from the rear, ruining their strategy. Would they really have been able to do such a thing if they weren't the best?
as and added note, Spartan women were especially strong. They were very capable of fending off men's advances if need be.

Nov 28, 2008 6:43 PM

Guest :

if you think trowing babys of clifs is harsh your wrong would you like to be thrown off at the age of 7 besides genghis khan would chop your legs of then tie your uper body to a hourses tail and then shoe it of that is so cool!

Nov 29, 2008 5:07 PM

Guest :

The wives had to dress up as men because spartan men were not attracted to women. so that means that they were all gay. lol

Dec 3, 2008 4:42 AM

Guest :

balls

Dec 3, 2008 9:34 AM

Guest :

What was unusual, to the eyes of other Greeks, about the life of Spartan women?
In the eyes of other Greeks Spartan women were seen as unusual because of their upbringing, education and training. To Athenians the freedom of Spartan women would have been seen as strange. The wedding rituals and life during marriage would have also been seen unusual.
In Athens the education of a woman would have included: weaving, spinning and other domestic arts. Menander, an Athenian man said, “Teaching a woman to read and write? What a terrible thing to do! However to Spartans these tasks were seen to be for the helots or perioeci. A girl’s education would be equally as fierce as the men’s. Spartan women would participate in many athletic events such as: javelin, discus and foot races. They would also run naked with their male counterparts. The most common exercise practised by Spartan women would be bibasis. A woman would have to jump as high as possible while kicking her buttocks. They trained like this as it was expected of Spartan women to produce healthy boys who would be able to become future warriors.
As well as being trained Spartan women were also taught too read and write. This made them literate and gave them a respected place in society. However Athenian women were not educated. The feelings of Athenian women are clearly shown by this famous playwright, Euripides, “of all living, thinking beings; we women are the most unlucky.” This shows that all Athenian female citizens were miserable. Compared to the Athenians, Spartan women were more fortunate as they had more freedoms.
There were many other activities that Spartan women practiced. As well as competing in athletic events they also participated in dancing and singing competitions. Dancing and choral competitions were held each year .The Spartan women would dance and sing in front of men at certain festivals. According to Plutarch it was not for a lack of modesty on the part of Spartan girls to perform dances. He quotes that Lycurgus, “made young girls no less than young men grow used to walking nude in processions, as well as to dancing and signing at certain festivals with the young men present and looking on”. Poetry was commonly recited throughout Greece. Men and the upper class of women in other cities of Greece only chanted it. However poetry was part of a Spartan women’s education. Sparta produced many female poets such as Megalostrata.

Dec 4, 2008 9:35 AM

Guest :

this is a very good web site

Dec 16, 2008 12:02 PM

Guest :

wow most of these posts are pretty retarded. and yea Spartans are awesome. Who care if they threw kids off cliffs or shaved womens heads. They were totally badass

Jan 6, 2009 5:18 PM

Guest :

how do you train like a spartan

Jan 7, 2009 10:25 PM

Guest :

Do any of you idiots realise that Spartans do not exist anymore? So what is the arguement? History is written by the WINNERS of campaigns, hence no real American history exists, only what THEY want to believe. Try winning a war on your own, then come back and comment on history

Jan 18, 2009 3:21 PM

Guest :

They weren't fed a light broth. My textbook says they were fed 'black soup', which was pork in animal blood with salt and vinegar. I heard somewhere that boys were not allowed to live with their parents, even as boys. They would have to sleep outside and steal their own food. They lived with a group of boys their age until they went to the barracks.

Jan 20, 2009 11:18 AM

Guest :

jesus, all of you are wrong
male WERE alowed to marry at age 30
men WERE allowed to own and maintain
there land and women had plenty of rights in sparta

Jan 20, 2009 5:48 PM

Guest :

Spartan people Have the strongest Army in land so if you ppl are going to be so dam retarded go be retarded some where else. I'm a very smart person and for the lack of human exsistance it seems we have become more stupid than normal and I'm sorry if that ofended you people but it's true.

Jan 21, 2009 7:25 AM

Guest :

SPARTA RULES

Jan 22, 2009 9:02 AM

Guest :

how long did the spartan military last?

Jan 22, 2009 9:02 AM

Guest :

how long did the spartan military last?

Feb 1, 2009 6:47 PM

Guest :

i am a soldier,...I AM SPARTA BITCH

Feb 8, 2009 11:54 AM

Guest :

oh my god it is ridiculous that they would throw babies off a cliff if they weren't healthy. That just makes me sick. I am studying Sparta for school and at least 3 other guys passed out cold when they said the babies were thrown off the cliff!!!
Caitie

Feb 11, 2009 11:16 AM

Guest :

you guys are dumb for caring about history soooo much

Feb 18, 2009 3:40 AM

Guest :

Yes the infants were not thrown off the cliff, they were left there to die.
And their mother was supposed to hand over the shield not wives.

Feb 18, 2009 9:58 AM

Guest :

Reading through the comments, it sounds like a bunch middle schoolers seem to be lurking around.
The overly use of profanity is indicating it.

Feb 18, 2009 9:59 AM

Guest :

Reading through the comments, it sounds like a bunch middle schoolers seem to be lurking around.
The overly use of profanity is indicating it.

Feb 18, 2009 4:56 PM

Guest :

most of the people commenting on this have no idea what thier talking about, the men where REQUIRED to wed at the age of 30. they would place the bride in a dark room on a bed, where the male would go and "abduct her". the relationship between young spartan boys and thier mentors was usually referred to as a non-sexual relantionship, as if it was indulging in thier own children, however, it wasn't unheard of, mind you this is something we don't know too much about. also, the men left ACTIVE military service at the age of 30, then RETIRED at the age of 60. meaning they would live at home unless they were immediately needed in a battle. not to mention the movie 300 does not accurately reflect the true spartan beliefs, such as the ephors refusing to allow war, they actually did, deeming the perisan threat to large to be ignored. it is also controversial as to wether or not they would throw babies deemed weak off cliffs, however due to thier rigourous training regime would require peak physical status, it is most likely that those who cried were either trained, or made into officers. by far worse things have been done in history, such as the assyrian's, they would go to a village, skin the villagers alive, cut thier eyes out, pile the dead bodies and behead them, pile the live bodies and burn them. they would proceed to hang the skins and heads on the city wall, and invite the rulers of neighboring cities to come see and say something along these lines: we had nothing against these people, but they didn't pay tribute to us ONCE, so imagine what were going to do to you if you don't pay yours. killing babies is horrible, don't get me wrong, but the assyrians did so much more.

Mar 2, 2009 6:46 AM

Guest :

spartans have amazing SIX PACKS!!!!!!!

Mar 3, 2009 2:45 PM

Guest :

at age 30 you were only allowed to marry id totally marry b4 that id be driven insane if i didn't marry some1. And y would any 1 throw their baby off a cliff that's like forcing the baby to do suicide without any option.
y the hells did they kill the slaves if they wanted the slaves to do work for them like really i wouldn't go around killing my slaves if i wanted them to do my work for me.

Mar 3, 2009 2:47 PM

Guest :

at age 30 you were only allowed to marry id totally marry b4 that id be driven insane if i didn't marry some1. And y would any 1 throw their baby off a cliff that's like forcing the baby to do suicide without any option.
y the hells did they kill the slaves if they wanted the slaves to do work for them like really i wouldn't go around killing my slaves if i wanted them to do my work for me.

Mar 5, 2009 1:49 AM

Guest :

they actually did throw babies off the cliff as other ancient greek societies also just left them at the botoom of the cliff and they were often taken in by older couples...but in sparta they didnt want them to have any chance of survival as it would make their civilisation weak so they did throw themm off the cliff

Mar 5, 2009 2:00 AM

Guest :

they killed the slaves to show the helot opoulation they were in control so they would live in fear...they were not going to just be slaves without a sever element of fear hence the intiation rite of the Krypteria group

Mar 9, 2009 3:42 AM

Guest :

I personaly think throwing babies that werent healthy or were deformed was mad because god made us to share his love on earth and that is just cruel and to shave your head before getting married is just wrong.

Mar 11, 2009 2:21 PM

Guest :

actually, the Spartan army was the best trained military force in the world, and the practices they used back then are inhumane, and there soldiers were also idiotic, they were bred to fight, while nowadays, people actually have lives and do other things besides kill and war. Besides, i bet you a Spartan Warrior couldnt survive a 50 cal round through the head.

Mar 17, 2009 11:02 AM

Guest :

The phrase 'come back with your shield or on it' was not as frequently used as this. it is actually a quote from one of homer's books which a mother said to her teenage son, probably as he conducted his last stage of training as detailed above

Mar 24, 2009 10:07 AM

Guest :

In ancient Sparta military training was the rule, not the exception. Sparta was an independent---some say the most independent-- city state in ancient Greece. The citizens of Sparta were great believers in their state. Ancient Spartans placed the state above themselves and the state demanded soldiers to protect it. Those too weak to be soldiers were too week to be Spartans. When a young boy was born to Spartan parents the father would take the child to the council of elders. These old calloused and scarred veterans would look at the naked infant carefully for any birth defects or the slightest sign of weakness or sickness. If they judged the crying baby to be unworthy of carrying a Spartan shield it would be taken immediately to a nearby cliff off Mt. Taygetos and thrown over the edge. If it passed this first of many life tests then the young Spartan boy would be allowed to return to his parent’s home where he lived for six years. Then the agoge or military training would start

When the young Spartan boy reached seven he was deemed too old to be coddled by his parents and was taken from them to live a military life for the rest of his existence. He was placed in a communal barracks with others his age, supervised by an older boy referred to as a Eirena who had respectively been the strongest in his class (and was himself undergoing something like officer training). For the next five years these Spartan boys were conditioned physically and mentally. They were educated- but only enough to count soldiers in a formation, read war sagas and sing and recite war poetry. . They were given rigorous strength and endurance training and physical conditioning through endless field and track events. They were taught wrestling and the art of ancient martial combat to make them lethal. They were fed -but it was a weak broth and in quantities only enough to exist. It was expected that the young starving boys would steal or otherwise find enough food to keep them strong. For this they would only be punished if caught and the lesson learned from this was how to look for food when none was available, a skill that would be needed in the future when occupying a village that had been sacked and abandoned. Discipline was the word to live by, with terrific punishments meted out if caught performing the most minor infraction.

At age twelve the lean and hungry boy was taken from the barracks and made to eat, live and sleep in one garment with no shoes under the open sky for one year, exposed to the beasts and the weather. This yearlong exercise taught survival and fieldcraft skills that he would need when deployed fighting abroad. From age thirteen until he reached what was considered manhood at twenty the Spartan child played very very serious war games. These games often left the contestants dead or injured and would include armed invasions on Messenian agricultural slaves called helots and other non Spartans living nearby. These war games taught small unit tactics, raids, reconnaissance and surveillance, and the art of the ambush. When age twenty was reached the Spartan boy was seen as a solder and had thirteen years of the hardest military training yet devised under his belt. For the next ten years he would still live in barracks as part of the standing army and only at age thirty were they allowed to marry and as a full fledged citizen, reproduce and achieve public office. It was only then that they were granted the privilege to live in their own house and not in barracks. This superbly trained Spartan soldier would still remain in the army no matter where he lived until age sixty when they were allowed to retire.

-----That is, if they were still alive.

Sources
The Spartans: The World of the Warrior-Heroes of Ancient Greece by Paul Cartledge

A War Like No Other: How the Athenians and Spartans Fought the Peloponnesian War by Victor Hanson



The copyright of the article Agoge - Spartan Military Training in Ancient Military History is owned by Christopher Eger. Permission to republish Agoge - Spartan Military Training in print or online must be granted by the author in writing.





Read more: "Agoge - Spartan Military Training: Sparta took twenty years to create the perfect Hoplite Warrior" - http://ancient-military-history.suite101.com/article.cfm/agoge_spartan_mili tary_training#ixzz0AgyXlkSV

Mar 28, 2009 8:26 PM

Guest :

thank u very much for this article practically saved me

Mar 28, 2009 8:26 PM

Guest :

thank u very much for this article practically saved me

Mar 30, 2009 4:45 PM

Guest :

Spartan woman had the most freedom at the time (from what I know). In Athens, women lived in a seperate area of the house, without windows (example, the rest of the house). They could not go into public unless it was for a funeral, religious festival, or family vists, and then they woud have to be with a household member at all times.

Also, Spartans left babies who would damage the power of their military as a whole. In other city-states, if babies were seen as "weak", they would be left at a specific spot within the city either to die or so someone could take them in as slaves.

The reason there were yearly murders of helots (essentially slaves whom did all of the farming as the Spartan men were full-time soldiers, allowing them to fight right through the harvest season, unlike Athens)as a boy's rite of passage was that they were out-numbered horrendously by the helots, and were constantly under fear of a helot revolt. So, they ruled through fear.

Sparta began as a peaceful city-state with cultural progress, invaders and slave revolts resulted in their development of a military-state with the greatest army in Greece.

Finally, shaving of hair was nothing. Many countries in the ancient world had shaved heads as a common siting. In Egypt, everyone had shaved heads and wore wigs (no joke).

Mar 30, 2009 5:20 PM

Guest :

Spartan woman had the most freedom at the time (from what I know). In Athens, women lived in a seperate area of the house, without windows (example, the rest of the house). They could not go into public unless it was for a funeral, religious festival, or family vists, and then they woud have to be with a household member at all times.

Also, Spartans left babies who would damage the power of their military as a whole. In other city-states, if babies were seen as "weak", they would be left at a specific spot within the city either to die or so someone could take them in as slaves.

The reason there were yearly murders of helots (essentially slaves whom did all of the farming as the Spartan men were full-time soldiers, allowing them to fight right through the harvest season, unlike Athens)as a boy's rite of passage was that they were out-numbered horrendously by the helots, and were constantly under fear of a helot revolt. So, they ruled through fear.

Sparta began as a peaceful city-state with cultural progress, invaders and slave revolts resulted in their development of a military-state with the greatest army in Greece.

Finally, shaving of hair was nothing. Many countries in the ancient world had shaved heads as a common siting. In Egypt, everyone had shaved heads and wore wigs (no joke).

Mar 31, 2009 3:17 PM

Guest :

Reading most of these commentsI have come to the conclusion that not one of you know anything aboutthe spartans. Your facts are distorted.The woman cut there hair short when they were young.The men were allowe to marry at age 20. At age 30 they were allowed to live with there families. At age 65 they were allow to enter the Goursia.

Apr 28, 2009 6:44 AM

Guest :

It wasn't a lack of repsect what they did to the women. They held their women in VERY high regard. They were treated like queens. They lioved this life to ensure their survival. Not like the cowards of today who strap bombs to their wives and children. These men were heros and their wives were their support. I think it's commendable how they lived.

May 7, 2009 2:39 AM

Guest :

Why are there many comment which the spelling is wrong?

May 8, 2009 12:23 AM

Guest :

To many people have seen Frank Miller's The 300 and take it as the gospel truth. This essay is pretty inaccurate, and even starts off by giving false information. Spartan babies who were deemed unworthy to become a part of society were not thrown over the edge of a cliff. Babies deemed unworthy of the society were taken to the top of a mountain and left to die on its own from exposure. I could have a field day with this essay, but I will leave it at that.

May 8, 2009 10:22 AM

Guest :

when a spartan was 12, they were thrown in to a room with a full grown worrior and was beaten with a sheild to see how tough they were.

May 8, 2009 10:24 AM

Guest :

when a spartan was 12, they were thrown in to a room with a full grown worrior and was beaten with a sheild to see how tough they were.

May 13, 2009 6:26 PM

Guest :

At 30 they were allowed to leave the barracks but had to return before the end of the day

Jun 5, 2009 2:21 PM

Guest :

Thx for the info

Jun 6, 2009 2:48 AM

Guest :

if u wanna get a proper feel of spartan military life watch 300 its epic and also gives a brief overview of agoggi.

Jun 6, 2009 3:48 PM

Guest :

All of you have seamed to forgotten the base of the spartan,pure fighting machine!!!!If a true sparton were to hear you down-grade them you would certainly be dead.

Jun 9, 2009 11:24 AM

Guest :

when i was a spartan i would eat peoples heads. not very tasty. i dont' recomend trying it.

Jun 9, 2009 11:25 AM

Guest :

when i was a spartan i would eat peoples heads. not very tasty. i dont' recomend trying it.

Jul 11, 2009 7:35 PM

Guest :

women were held in high respects in the spartan society than in any other society. women were treated worse in other city-states or countries. so just because they had to go under some less respectable scenarios, doesnt mean they werent held in high regard. t

Jul 11, 2009 7:36 PM

Guest :

women were held in high respects in the spartan society than in any other society. women were treated worse in other city-states or countries. so just because they had to go under some less respectable scenarios, doesnt mean they werent held in high regard. t

Jul 11, 2009 7:43 PM

Guest :

nobody would survive a 50 cal round through the head, but i guarantee you none of our own military would be able to win over a spartan in close combat without guns.

Jul 12, 2009 5:41 AM

Guest :

Its so funny you all seem to think your are right no matter what, but were any of you there in 700 BC say maybe 600 BC no oh ok 500 BC. Oh ok so i see now none of you were so how do any of you know for sure without a doubt that you are all right who knows exactly how they treated their women, and who knows wether a baby crying or not decided what. A baby has to cry in order to take its first breath so that it can clear its through. mayeby all of yall should try doing some research or wait mayeby not because nobody can prove anything that happend 2500 years ago unless some of you geniuses build a time machine, so keep arguing it only gets you so far, so far as far is no were. (;

Aug 2, 2009 12:42 PM

Guest :

Agoge is a system the US should emulate! Just call it the Boy Scouts. Regional agoge systems in each region of the US or state. Those that are not fit for military should be placed in technology based agoge schools that would put them on course to help re-establish the US as a technological leader.

Aug 11, 2009 11:06 PM

Guest :

Every one who comments about the babie paradox in a negative matter is a pussy- America and every other country should strive to emulate this type of perfection. Its the weakness of you pussies that is bringing this country down. A militaristic rule similar to that of sparta should be the new way of goverment in this country so as to re-enstate us as the strongest and most feard power in the world.

Aug 22, 2009 9:02 PM

Guest :

spartan boys where not left out for a year at the of age 12 they where left on the mountain taygetos for five days when they where 13

Sep 21, 2009 5:35 PM

Guest :

THIS. IS. SPARTA!

Sep 21, 2009 5:35 PM

Guest :

THIS. IS. SPARTA!

Sep 21, 2009 5:36 PM

Guest :

THIS. IS. SPARTA!

Sep 24, 2009 11:34 AM

Guest :

the spartans were the greatest warriors under mount olympus they were nearly undefeatable

Sep 25, 2009 8:31 PM

Guest :

Sparta women had it easy Athens women had NO rights at all so stop whining about respect

Sep 29, 2009 4:45 PM

Guest :

this is a true very true essay about the spartans that is how they lived every bit of that its true if you dont think it is true then u are dumb and need to go back to school because you are very very dumb you idots who think some of this is wrong are WRONG this is ALL TRUE

Sep 29, 2009 4:45 PM

Guest :

this is a true very true essay about the spartans that is how they lived every bit of that its true if you dont think it is true then u are dumb and need to go back to school because you are very very dumb you idots who think some of this is wrong are WRONG this is ALL TRUE

Oct 28, 2009 5:56 PM

Guest :

A mother told her son " come back with your shield or be carried on it, btw thank u so much this helped me out alot for my socail studies project:)

Oct 29, 2009 10:28 AM

Guest :

The idea of throwing a baby off of the cliff is intriguing. It's not necessarily wrong. I would throw a baby off a cliff...